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  #31  
Old October 4th, 2017, 04:24 AM
Aashika Aashika is offline
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Re: Hope no one is there in Vegas right now...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dovahkiin View Post
That's the one that amazes me, how could a deranged man bring 2 dozen guns and thousands of bullets in his room without raising any alarm. Answer might lie in fact that Las Vegas hosts world's largest gun show organized by Nation Shooting Sports foundation, So anybody carrying that many weapon and ammunition is not an uncommon sight there.

Just like previous question, I can't offer any satisfactory explanation, Along with last one, this too might indicate some conspiracy.
Once you check in, no one really keeps track of when the guest is coming in and going. He could have concealed the weapons in a suitcase and brought them in from different entrances in that fairly big hotel.
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  #32  
Old October 4th, 2017, 06:42 AM
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Re: Hope no one is there in Vegas right now...

The whole thing is, Nevada is a free state, as per the JPEG I posted earlier, so what if someone is doing….. or into the selling and buying and in the business of arms?
A single man of 64 yrs old, ppl would not doubt much, unless the hunk-hogans and macho styled, tattoo-muscled, gangsters gang looking like, takes entry in Hotel,.. !

e.g. In Gujarat, the cop may check yr baggage for any possible alcohol bottle,..,,and perhaps may hold you by a collar,… but not in Mumbai,…. When it’s legally free to buy, keep and drink it !

Well,.. Wasn't there a lady with this guy too? She was in Japan ( perhaps Philippines ) by the time, last I heard she was coming back voluntarily for questioning.

From somebody who knows about guns and crimes:

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I AGREE


These are legal.

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Tell you,..

Banning guns for 99.99% of the population that use them responsibly isn't going to stop freak incidents like this. Just like banning drugs haven't stopped their use.

But hey,.. accept it will. The change won't happen overnight, but restricting the supply of guns will make guns harder to get for everyone. That's why criminals in Europe and Australia for the most part don't use guns. There simply aren't enough guns for all the criminals.

Please provide me with a developed country with gun restrictions, that has gun violence rates similar to the US. Please explain to me why the US is unique in terms of gun violence amongst developed countries?

You've touched on mental health. Sure, this guy has mental health issues. We have crazy people here too. Except here, they don't have access to machine guns. People here with mental health issues are limited to making angry internet posts, and trying to overdose on diazepam + paracetamol. In America, they buy machine guns and open fire at the public.

One can also argue that in the US, poverty plays a bigger hand. It's true that there are more poor people in America that other developed countries. The fact of the matter remains that there are poor people in Australia, and they do not commit gun violence. I can walk through the 'ghettos' of any Australian major city at midnight, and be confident that I am safe. Whilst there are 'poor' and 'rich' areas in Australian cities, there are no 'safe' and 'unsafe' areas.

Is it the macho culture? Australia also has a macho culture among many young men. In Australia, the macho guys punch their mates at the bar to prove how tough they are. The victims end up with a broken nose, not a bullet in their skull.

Also, Tougher gun controlled policy can not succeed in USA since the Republican congress members have been hijacked by the a few millions gun lovers and these congress members have place the party political interest above the majority American citizens' safety.

The real democracy should not be played around by party political interests. Any important law and policy should be place for referendum
and all citizens can decide.

In any society, there will always remain a criminal aspect. Similarly, gun violence will continue to exist in almost all societies. What tighter gun restrictions can achieve is dramatically reducing the frequency and magnitude of gun violence.
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  #33  
Old October 4th, 2017, 08:18 AM
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Re: Hope no one is there in Vegas right now...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aashika View Post
Once you check in, no one really keeps track of when the guest is coming in and going. He could have concealed the weapons in a suitcase and brought them in from different entrances in that fairly big hotel.
What if he was assembling a bomb there? one week he goes in and out a hundred times.. what's stopping him from doing it?

In India every frikkin time you enter the hotel (3 to 5 star) your belongings (ladies purse, suitcases, bags, etc) are scanned and you are frisked.

US needs to do the same, I think this will start to happen now. I expect hotels to get costlier by 20-30% minimum.
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  #34  
Old October 4th, 2017, 09:16 AM
Aashika Aashika is offline
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Re: Hope no one is there in Vegas right now...

Quote:
Originally Posted by sarv_shaktimaan View Post
What if he was assembling a bomb there? one week he goes in and out a hundred times.. what's stopping him from doing it?

In India every frikkin time you enter the hotel (3 to 5 star) your belongings (ladies purse, suitcases, bags, etc) are scanned and you are frisked.

US needs to do the same, I think this will start to happen now. I expect hotels to get costlier by 20-30% minimum.
they also have security checking you and belongings in all major malls too
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  #35  
Old October 4th, 2017, 09:31 AM
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Re: Hope no one is there in Vegas right now...

Here, I go to the court for tons of hearings ,... every-time you have to put away your Key, money-spare, Belt and any metal belongings, Cell in a separate bowl and then they scan you.. ( provided, no one can carry Guns / pistol in hearing / meditation and shoon's someone,... )




Apparently she denies the quote.



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  #36  
Old October 4th, 2017, 12:47 PM
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Re: Hope no one is there in Vegas right now...

I do not know, what is Dovah pai or sgar pai thinks,.. but,..

It is insanity.
And then when you consider Trump has recently lifted gun checks for mentally ill people, the whole craziness simply leaves you lost for words. Now will the US think about banning automatic rifles? An attack on a country music festival, I can assume many will be pro gun, will this change minds? Although attacks on little kids hasn't changed anything so I doubt thus will. I don't think this debate about the semantics of the word terrorism is necessarily helpful, but I've always understood terrorism to mean using violence in order to get people or their government to support/change their ways with regard to a political/religious/other cause. Terrorism is violence in the name of a cause. And now we have a new technique to kill and maim as many people as possible, book a hotel room overlooking spots with large amount of people. Are there many hotels overlooking roofless stadiums?

A random person going mad with a gun in a crowd because something went 'snap' in their head isn't terrorism, it's mass murder. Until quite recently this was fairly uncontroversial definition of the word, and it's still the one I use. So I'm with the sheriff; until a motive is discovered this isn't terrorism, as callous as that might sound, but I do think meanings of words are important.

Besides which, there's a very odd thing in the US. Even if this was motivated by a cause and could uncontroversially be called terrorism, the sheriff could still technically be right in law. As we found out in Charlottesville, there isn't a crime of "domestic terrorism" in the US.... I had said, Biggest mass shooting in US history and barely a whimper on the skybar.

Just goes to show there is a limit to how sympathetic you can be to the collective idiocy that allows this situation to keep happening. I tell you, More feeling a bit numb about it.
Completely unreal situation. A man must have walked into a hotel lobby with a machine gun and a truckload of ammo in his suitcase ("shall I help you carry that?" "No no, I'll take it myself"), booked a room, probably asked for a view over the festival, and a while later scores of people are being gunned down.
Bizarre doesn't cover it. Truly, It's a very sad event. So many lives wasted due to the actions of one crazed guy who ended up killing himself. He may be responsible for killing, but the automatic weapons have enabled him to do it on such a wide scale. The NRA's twitter is so far quiet about this incident. 500 + wounded, 50+ dead. The guy was in the hotel for over a week. Shot himself prior to cops breaching his room.
He was firing full auto into the crowd. 10 rifles in his room. Hotel room had multiple automatic weapons, he'd been staying there some the 28th September.

The woman they were looking for, the one he lived with was not in the country at the time.

Gunman killed himself before the police got to the room.

Reuters are saying that apparently the guy converted to Islam a few months ago.

IS are claiming responsibility.

ISIS claimed responsibility for burning my pizza last week, they literally claim everything bad that happens to westerners is because of them. They are now little more than a twitter profile.

As for this latest shooting, nothing will happen. Trump will probably inform us that it wouldn't have happened if everyone at that music festival had their own gun to defend themselves with. Just awful for the victims who were out enjoying themselves. Tell ya,.. All the God stuff aside, that's the best I've ever heard Trump speak. Of course, no mentions of gun control, that would be expecting too much, but he at least came across as Presidential. I know that's the absolute minimum anyone should expect from a US President, but he's missed so many times before. Gun Violence Archive, a website that tracks incidents and crimes involving guns across the United States, said Sunday night's attack was the 273rd mass shooting in the country this year.

It defines a "mass shooting" as four or more people being shot at the same time or location. Apparently "freedom" looks a lot like Somalia then.
We've been here before, dozens of times, and I'm really, really not trying to pick a fight now, but don't you think that the fact that this is almost routine, in a Western, affluent country, is shocking enough in itself? Look the Americans will not bring in legislation to control guns.

Historically this is because citizens wanted protection from their own government but also the likes of Red Indians, Mexicans and outlaws during a time where you couldn't count on or guarantee protection from the Government.

More recent decades have seen largely republican voters wanting to keep the gun laws and largely democrat voters wanting to change the gun laws.

Now that Trump has been elected President the liberal democrat voters can simply now understand why people want guns.

I don't see the democrats giving up guns as long as Trump is in charge that's for damn sure! The NRA spent $30million on Donald Trump's campaign, anyone expecting a change in gun laws may as well expect the CEO's of McDonald's to come out in favour of the US adopting an all vegan diet.

Many Americans, again, foolishly doubling down ...
Uh ! http://www.sfgate.com/business/natio...s-12246441.php

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  #37  
Old October 4th, 2017, 12:49 PM
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Re: Hope no one is there in Vegas right now...

Speculation is that the shooter was using extended 100-round drum magazines, quite possibly on something like AR-15 assault rifles.





Now, I believe that one of the stipulations in the foiled, but very vanilla gun bill Obama tried to introduce was the restricting of the sale of extended magazines.

This was after the Sandy Hook massacre, where toddlers were literally blown apart by a lunatic armed with something similar.
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  #38  
Old October 4th, 2017, 06:56 PM
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Re: Hope no one is there in Vegas right now...

These mass shootings, while not unique to the US, are certainly at epidemic levels here more than anywhere else. It actually would be easier to deal with psychologically if it were a Islamic suicide bomber. That's why I'm finding their arguments off-base.

It's a matter of the devil you know vs. the devil you don't. With this type in Las Vegas, what is the enemy we're fighting? Guns? Psychopathy? Pop culture, and a possible inadvertent sensationalism of thrill killers by the media? All of the above?

But as the criminal experts come forward, few if any of the personal profile common denominators associated with mass killers seem to be evident with this one. He didn't seem clinically disturbed. He was successful, "high functioning" as to even meticulously plan this. Not socially isolated. Not even young as most of these lone wolf types have been. There's likely something significant yet to be uncovered that happened in his recent past. If they are to find anything, they will have to dig for this one.

Also, Regardless of whether only brown people get called terrorists or not, it is a fact that people killed by brown people are given orders of magnitude more importance. You can count in double digits the number of people killed by brown people in last 10 years in the US. The number of people killed in total in the last 10 years is in 6 figures. Yet from all that you hear, you'd think that the two are at least comparable in scale (putting it mildly).

Doc Dova and Many thinks,...Hard to believe that a flabby senior person managed to sneak in 42 guns and ammo and then fired thousands of rounds all by himself. However, It's not hard to believe at all. I guess he could have had them all in his vehicle and brought them up to the room bit by bit while he was staying there, I doubt he could have carried them all up in one go.

Firing an automatic weapon at a large target wouldn't have been so difficult though, this guy seems to have been very used to guns so he should have been well capable of that i think. It was just lots of suitcases. They already see this on the surveillance tapes at Mandalay Bay. They are combing these for more clues, as in possibly anyone else he may have met, etc, etc. Probably at neighboring Luxor, Excalibur as well, if not other hotels and venues up the strip. Apart from the "sneaking in" part, flabby senior persons go to shooting ranges all over the US every day, often firing thousands of rounds, and/or carrying a large number of guns from their cars to the ranges. And the guy had several days to prepare, and the hotel presumably has elevators. It's not like anybody claims he openly carried all the weapons and ammunition from the hotel lobby to his room, up the staircase, in a single trip.

Btw, sanelassi pai,..Did we downplay the Boston bombings by the Tsarnaev's once we discovered they were Caucasian Chechens? Hundreds were injured there too.

He did it over several days, packed into suitcases. How do you check into a hotel? Has the hotel staff ever rummaged through your suitcase to see what you're packing?

YouTube is killing human society. There are already conspiracy theories that this was some kind of CIA/NWO operation, "because one man can't have these many weapons in a hotel."

I'm just trying to connect the dots here. This attack doesn't resemble other mass shooters who had a day or two of rage (combined with their long term insanity of course) and killed a lot of people. He actually endured many days or even weeks of absolute madness but not mad enough as to carry on with his insane plan without any apparent flaws. No regrets in between? No screw ups? No set backs? No one noticed anything strange in his room full of heavy boxes? And then shoot standing for more than 20 minutes in the heat of Las Vegas despite being in the morning?

It's just a lot of work for just one person. Perhaps he acted alone but who knows really.

Do they know when he booked the room? If he booked it months in advance then he must have(or well, could have) had the festival targeted for many months.

btw, The US media and government were talking about San Bernadino months after it happened. Let's see if it happens with the Vegas attack.

Mind you, it's more apt to compare San Bernadino to something like the Aurora theatre shooting, since a similar number of people were killed. Which do you think got more coverage?

btw,... During the Shooting, my friend's friend was at the Times Square. The Police there has big Military guns. Wasn`t it possible for a trained Police officer to shoot back?




But i guess, The angle from the ground up to the 30th floor(or whatever it was) would probably make that very hard(read impossible), unless the perpetrator was hanging out the window(no reason for that), I have seen no footage of the events but he could have set up a meter or so into the room as well, nullifying any chance to get him in the sights, moreover, "peppering" a hotel facade could cause collateral damage.

Could use a helicopter of course, but that would also be a risk.

what do you think, SS paji and sgar pai ?
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  #39  
Old October 5th, 2017, 02:38 PM
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Re: Hope no one is there in Vegas right now...

Folks,.. SS paaji, Sgar pai, sane-less pai,... lemme tell ya,...

I really hate these storeis the media pumps out after an event like this. It's always the same bullshit. "Oh he was such a nice guy." lol True! I hate that shit too! They're always like "oh he was such a lovely guy!" "oh he was so nice!" Like fcuk off! What say Ssanelassi Pai ?

Are family members, coworkers, neighbors psychologists? Are they legitimate sources that can tell you about the sate of mind of this guy?

I read he had booked rooms in another hotel in Las Vegas with good sight lines towards another festival, as well as one in Chicago during a music festival there as well, that was in August, so he either loved music or he was going for that type pf event, probably because of the big crowds.

I watched a bunch of videos. Could not see any muzzle flash or even tracer rounds during the firing, anywhere. Also couldn't see any rising smoke which apparently is what lead to the swat teams in locating the shooter.

Apparently this guy gambled a million dollars a year!
http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/04/us/pad...nvs/index.html

Quote:
He stood about 6-foot-4 but came across as "low key and relaxed, a good guy," one of the real estate agents recalled, speaking on condition of anonymity. Balding and paunchy, Paddock was the opposite of flashy. On his application, he said his income came from "gambling." He said he gambled about $1 million a year
Reading through that article, makes me wonder if his motivation for the shooting was nothing more than going out in the biggest, flashiest way he possibly could. Like, "TA DA! See ya folks! It's been nice, and thanks for all the fish!"

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Old October 5th, 2017, 02:41 PM
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Re: Hope no one is there in Vegas right now...

The other thing, I would like to mention to you all EC folks, holding debate here, of aashika's thread,..

It was just lots of suitcases. They already see this on the surveillance tapes at Mandalay Bay. They are combing these for more clues, as in possibly anyone else he may have met, etc, etc. Probably at neighboring Luxor, Excalibur as well, if not other hotels and venues up the strip. Apart from the "sneaking in" part, flabby senior persons go to shooting ranges all over the US every day, often firing thousands of rounds, and/or carrying a large number of guns from their cars to the ranges. And the guy had several days to prepare, and the hotel presumably has elevators. It's not like anybody claims he openly carried all the weapons and ammunition from the hotel lobby to his room, up the staircase, in a single trip.

Hopefully because they enjoy hanging out down at the shooting range. Guns can be fun, and I'm not even a gun enthusiast(got a couple in the extended family who are though, and where our family owns land, you can do pretty much as you like, 2nd home to our family). As for semi-automatic rifles, those can be used in IPSC competitions for example. This is an international sport, and there are people from many countries who practice it.

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He did it over several days, packed into suitcases. How do you check into a hotel? Has the hotel staff ever rummaged through your suitcase to see what you're packing?

YouTube is killing human society. There are already conspiracy theories that this was some kind of CIA/NWO operation, "because one man can't have these many weapons in a hotel."

I'm just trying to connect the dots here. This attack doesn't resemble other mass shooters who had a day or two of rage (combined with their long term insanity of course) and killed a lot of people. He actually endured many days or even weeks of absolute madness but not mad enough as to carry on with his insane plan without any apparent flaws. No regrets in between? No screw ups? No set backs? No one noticed anything strange in his room full of heavy boxes? And then shoot standing for more than 20 minutes in the heat of Las Vegas despite being in the morning?

It's just a lot of work for just one person. Perhaps he acted alone but who knows really.

Though,
Quote:
It's rather crazy that it has come to a point where politicians are so scared of armed civilians they don't dare change a dumb outdated law to something more modern that could save 10-15.000 lives each year

No law or even a complete ban will save that many lives from gun violence a year it's just a pipe dream of yours. There are around 30,000 deaths annually from firearms. Of those figures about 20,000 of them all from suicide. That leaves about 10,000 people that died in our country annually that we would all consider innocent people. But did you know that just as many people died at the hands of a drunk driver annually in our country. Something tells me that you are in no mood for Banning any type of hard alcohol or how about any beers above the level of 5% by volume. If we are going to be outraged about innocent people losing their lives let's be completely outraged across-the-board not just cherry picking the things that we don't agree with.

Are guys / Echarchans with me so far ?
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Old October 5th, 2017, 02:45 PM
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Re: Hope no one is there in Vegas right now...

Muzzle flashing seems to indicate the shooter was on a lower floor, while police saying 32nd floor where no flashing was observed.

Interesting video from a taxi, Sounds like multiple shooters.

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Many ppl have asked me this question on social media, that During the Shooting my friend was at the Times Square. The Police there has big Military guns. Wasn`t it possible for a trained Police officer to shoot back?

Well,..
Across such a distance where all you can observe is muscle flashes from a hotel filled with people it would be very irresponsible to start shooting back..

With a proper rifle a soldier here is trained to hit a 1m tall target at 600m with 7,62mm and 500m with 5,56mm ( Nato standard ) but a person likely laying down in a hotel shooting through a small hole in a reflective window - that's a target around the size of laptop and you have to account for altitude/elevation as well as wind.. and we are talking cops, not soldiers..

You would need a trained sniper and spotter for such response to be acceptable and they still wouldn't know if he had filled his room with hostages or if it was even a person and not a remotely operated rifle - all in all not a situation I think any person in charge would accept - they really had no choice but to charge the room..

And if the shooter was wearing a helmet and on the floor you'd perhaps only have a 20x6cm area to hit from such a distance ( that's about the size of a modern smartphone ) with so many factors.. the odds are too low and the chance to civilians too high

Against enemy combatants on a conflict zone you can use suppressible fire - but against a suicidal shooter in an area packed with people that's not an acceptable tactic..

( heck in this day and age ballistic masks are getting affordable and good making it even harder to take people out - Mark my words - soon we will see people packed in protective gear running amock and police having a very hard time taking them out with regular weapons, including rifles! )

Tell ya sgar pai, No law or even a complete ban will save that many lives from gun violence a year it's just a pipe dream of yours. There are around 30,000 deaths annually from firearms. Perhaps,… That is the situation for the rest of the developed world, so there's no reason why the US wouldn't see the same results as all those nations by enforcing a limitation in availability..

In Europe having the death and destruction of WW2 in mind made such limitations easier ( and later we got the Yugoslavian civil war and other conflicts ) but eventually the mass killings in the US will too make people rethink if it's "worth it"..

No civilian needs a gun and those who likes guns can go to gun clubs and shoot all they want.. the US could have so many lives and make life so much safer and save so much money on law-enforcement - there's simply neither logic, reason or any sanity to today's situation and many people are paying a very high price for the nonsense gun laws..

With me? What aashika has to say on this ?
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Old October 6th, 2017, 05:57 AM
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Re: Hope no one is there in Vegas right now...

Quote:
Originally Posted by log1iszero View Post
With me? What aashika has to say on this ?
I am against the gun licenses being given with little or no investigation as to why you need a gun.

Yes, while not giving a gun will not solve the issue, it will bring down the ease at which these psychopaths acquire the guns. How did he get hold of so many refiles and so much ammo without proper record?

I have always wondered who is the greatest enemy we are fighting here? Is it the guns or gods or Putin or psychopaths?
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Old October 6th, 2017, 08:11 AM
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Re: Hope no one is there in Vegas right now...




U said it,.. and btw,.. u said it all,…

Gun control a must. Also rather put EXTREMELY more control on bullet factories , magazine, cartridges,.. and its smuggling, which will make guns useless,… But, hey,.. USA is a country, say,..even you go the store like Dicks’ ( as the name suggests ) and with clothes and apparels you see 10s of such real guns being sold ( even a kid can buy ) to kill deer, and hunting hobby and bear and grizzly killing guns for mountaineers,.. etc, so how and where you can control those mountain camp, and adventurous macho man enthusiasts, who likes wild life and to live with Nature ? The people I talked to work, they all who lived in Bundas were keeping such small level of shooter guns, to kill even wild cats, raccoons and sometimes bear and croco,.. even snakes,… other strange animals found in their forest like backyards,.. !

There are the naked level of data,on net, which clearly shows that it has killed more ppl in USA than any wars.

This video show that, guy’s father was also a robber, killer, w/ criminal records and full all kind of evils,.. though this guy moved from Florida and ppl think that he was such a nice guy,. ( oh ! F U ) but Florida area may be knowing him more,… This guy was fond of music concerts, and had also attended many before,.. so my guess is either he did not get a ticket for a good seat, was having no money for that, or perhaps he lost money in casino and had no opt left except to suicide, so he thought why not kill 1000+ just like WTC and take also many with me ! btw,… If he had 10 rifles, than think over, if he had, out all on tripod at the same time, with auto-firing, the causalities be in thousands,.. Also it looks like,… firing stops after every 30 sec, so most prol’y he was alone and was taking time to load the cartridges belt,… ! Music concert was for 3 days, but he waited for the right day and the turn of some famous singer so that he can shoot and hunt large chunk of pool of public to hunt them down,…

Only Doc Dova can throw some more light on this, after watching this video, hope you also saw the above taxiwala’s video,..

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I AGREE





First 9 months of 2017 in US:



www.gunviolencearchive


….
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Old October 6th, 2017, 08:13 AM
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Re: Hope no one is there in Vegas right now...

Girlfriend:
Quote:
Quote:
“I knew Stephen Paddock as a kind, caring, quiet man,” Marilou Danley, Paddock’s girlfriend, said in a statement read by her attorney. “He never said anything to me or took any action that I was aware of that I understood in any way to be a warning that something horrible like this was going to happen.”


https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/gi...b7Kz&ocid=iehp

[via Washington Post]

Just gets creepier. Something very Stepford about the brother's ("he's just a guy who lived in a house") and GF's statements. Essentially emotionless.

There was a similar shooting incident in a casino in the Philippines that happened barely a year ago involving a gambling addict who gambled even his family's wealth and lost it all. Well, in that incident too, ISIS tried to claim the attack, but was refuted by the national police. Gambling can get you mad if it involves a lot of money..and losing all of it. There should be regulations on how much you can gamble in casinos in relative to your net worth. Gambling is just as addictive as other behaviors out there, more so because it involves a lot of money.

I really hate these stories the media pumps out after an event like this. It's always the same bullshit. "Oh he was such a nice guy."

Are family members, coworkers, neighbors psychologists? Are they legitimate sources that can tell you about the sate of mind of this guy?

The media always does this, "creating a mystery thriller" out of a real life tragic event as if we're watching a fictional movie. But years later, after a thorough investigation, in every case we eventually learn the killer was a mad man, with all kinds of psychological problems. Just because someone hides their problems from friends and family does not mean they are not there. And the media does us no service by bullshiting the audience with all this fakery.

Nobody knows who this guy is right now, not even his family. Some clues. His family had not seen him in years. Yeah that's normal. He gambled 1million a year. Yeah, that's normal. He was quiet, did not have many friends, etc. Where have we heard this before? This is what the media should be reexporting on, not creating fake drama, and a mystery thriller out of a real life tragic event.

Time. In time, with a proper investigation we'll know more. The media is really out of control in this country. And it's the media that is RESPONSIBLE for these mass shootings.

Let see, what sgar pai says on this ?

How America has silently accepted the rage of white men
Quote:
Quote:
In the wake of one of the worst massacres in modern American history, our government's highest leaders will be silent about why things like this keep happening. "Warmest condolences" will be tweeted to families of those who lost their lives, minutes of mourning will pass and murmurs of mental health issues and lone-wolf actors will taper into silence. Taming homegrown terror and tightening gun control will be dismissed as inappropriate or unnecessary politicizing of a tragedy and quickly become secondary to more pressing issues on the administration's agenda. America has been here before.

In fact, America has been here 273 times in 2017 alone, according to the Gun Violence Archive, which compiles deaths and injuries from shooting incidents and defines a mass shooting as any incident where four or more people are wounded or killed. According to their tally, there have also been 11,698 deaths as a result of gun violence so far this year. Between 2001 and 2014, 440,095 deaths by firearms occurred on US soil, while deaths by terrorism during those years numbered 3,412. Today, America faces approximately one mass shooting per day on average.

Mass shootings are a violent epidemic that have been met with fatal passivity for far too long. If mass shootings were perpetrated mostly by brown bodies, this would quickly be re-framed and reformed as an immigration issue. If thousands died at the hands of black men, it would be used to excuse police brutality, minimize the Black Lives Matter movement and exacerbate the "raging black man" stereotype. If mass shooters identified as Muslim, it would quickly become terrorism and catalyze defense and security expenditures.


http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/03/opinio...on0844AMVODtop

Should be " How American government..." instead

Wouldn't be surprised if the suspect got away and to save face the authorities blamed it on somebody else. I read he had booked rooms in another hotel in Las Vegas with good sight lines towards another festival, as well as one in Chicago during a music festival there as well, that was in August, so he either loved music or he was going for that type pf event, probably because of the big crowds. The guy used a flash suppressor. Also, it's possible that he didn't poke his gun out of the window, but just shot through the holes he had already created. That would make the flashes less visible from street level.

Some says,.. also couldn't see any rising smoke which apparently is what lead to the swat teams in locating the shooter. well...
You couldn't see it on grainy videos taken from a distance of several hundred meters. However, the hotel's smoke detectors could, since they were in the room where it happened (shooting tends to produce a lot of aptly named gunsmoke, and indoors it will just pile up). Any good fire alarm system will report the location of the smoke by room number to a central server somewhere on the ground floor (intended to be quickly read by the fire department upon arriving at the building). As soon as the SWAT team had determined what direction the shots were coming from, there could really only be one building where the culprit was hiding. And the central fire alarm display of the building showed one room where smoke detectors were making a fuzz. Doesn't take much to connect the dots from there on, particularly since hotel security had already sent a guy up to have a look at what was setting off the alarm. a security guy was shot in the leg when he approached the room. For everyone's luck, he didn't die, because over 200 shots were fired in the corridor and he sustained only a knee shot.

so he called the rest of the staff of the hotel who warned cops.

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Last edited by log1iszero; October 6th, 2017 at 08:43 AM.
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Old October 6th, 2017, 08:40 AM
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Re: Hope no one is there in Vegas right now...

Las Vegas Strip shooter prescribed anti-anxiety drug in June
Quote:
Quote:
Stephen Paddock, who killed at least 58 people and wounded hundreds more in Las Vegas on Sunday with high-powered rifles, was prescribed an anti-anxiety drug in June that can lead to aggressive behavior, the Las Vegas Review-Journal has learned.

Records from the Nevada Prescription Monitoring Program obtained Tuesday show Paddock was prescribed 50 10-milligram diazepam tablets by Henderson physician Dr. Steven Winkler on June 21.

[...]
Diazepam is a sedative-hypnotic drug in the class of drugs known as benzodiazepines, which studies have shown can trigger aggressive behavior. Chronic use or abuse of sedatives such as diazepam can also trigger psychotic experiences, according to drugabuse.com.

Only Doc Dova can throw more light, that's all our best assumption be and should... It's very easy to get a prescription to valium. Doctors don't seem to ask enough questions before prescribing it.

My interpretation is that he wanted the valium so he could act calmly during the preparation and shooting. The anti-anxiety effect is just what was needed to enable him to execute his plan without arousing suspicion.

He seemed to have started his plan a year ago, when he started building up his arsenal (at least 30 guns in the year). Getting valium in May could have been one part of the plan. Holy shit talk about preparation. If this is the case it makes it even more sinister.

I was prescribed Temazepam and diazepam last year after my car accident and they do not make you aggressive at all!! Pretty much the polar opposite. They impair your motor functions, make you feel 90 lbs heavier and eventually cause you to fall into a deep sleep.

The only way you'd be a threat while on Benzos is if you were driving or operating heavy machinery. I would hardly be able to even lift a gun once they kicked in, let alone shoot one. I wonder - if the guy's brains are all still in one piece - if he had something going wrong in there. I know there's certain tumors, diseases, etc that alter your mental state and make you susceptible to being an obsessive gambler, etc.He was prescribed drugs...what a surprise.

Now, will you consider this remarkable,.. what SS pai thinks on this ?
Remarkable!

Australia amnesty nets 50,000 guns

'As a result of this successful amnesty, there are now 50,000 fewer firearms on the streets,' says Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull

Agence France-Presse
@afp
Published 2:56 PM, October 06, 2017
Updated 2:56 PM, October 06, 2017
Quote:
Quote:
SYDNEY, Australia – More than 50,000 guns were handed in under Australia's first national firearms amnesty since a mass shooting 20 years ago, officials said Friday, October 6.

The 3-month operation ended last weekend, just before retired accountant Stephen Paddock massacred 58 people in Las Vegas in an act that propelled gun control back into the global spotlight.

Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull said there had been "an overwhelming response" to the amnesty.

"Australia has some of the strongest gun laws in the world but illicit firearms remain a threat to community safety," he said.

"As a result of this successful amnesty, there are now 50,000 fewer firearms on the streets."
I tell you aashika ji,.... perhaps you may have lived in Canada but not Australia yet,... but,.. Well done Australia!

Here a similar event over the summer( after the punishment for illegal gun persession was raised to 2 years prison ) bagged 10.459 guns.. however most of those were old "resistance guns" from WW2 that is quite commonly found by family in attics and storage rooms when old seniors who lived through the war dies ( the weapons where dropped by the British and divided out across the population to aid the resistance fighter ) as well as various old hunting shotguns old people forgot to turn in once their hunting licence expired or guns that predates registering times - but hey it's still guns off the streets even if most are barely in working condition anymore.

https://www.rappler.com/world/region...-thousand-guns

aashika, I tell you...So far investigators have zero clue about a possible motive. Nothing they have found brings them closer to understand why this has happened at all yet. My gut feeling tells me he has done this out of pure joy for killing. Which would make this attack just totally insane. The lack of the motive and the appearance that this is a plan long in the making make this a peculiar case. He didn't just snap. It's possible something happened a year ago that made him take the decision but he seems to have planned and executed in a calm way.

I don't think joy of killing is a likely reason. My guess is that he took little joy from it. It seems more a detached exercise to see if he could do it, more like a real life computer game. It's just the why that is so baffling. sgar pai, you might be thinking...I feel like trying to find a rational answer for each of such cases sometimes isn´t possible. We humans tend to try to find sense in everything that occurs, but sometimes even such gruesome acts like this happen without any real or rational reason. And i also think there are sick individuals out there who enjoy committing a killing spree like the one at the Mandalay.

Hmmm ...

Vegas Shooter’s Girlfriend Says He Would Lie in Bed Moaning, Screaming

Quote:
Quote:
Marilou Danley, the woman investigators hoped would provide key details into the motive behind her boyfriend's deadly shooting attack, said she remembers him exhibiting symptoms such as lying in bed and moaning, according to two former FBI officials who have been briefed on the matter.

"She said he would lie in bed, just moaning and screaming, 'Oh, my God,'" one of the former officials said.

The other former official said Danley spoke about Paddock displaying "mental health symptoms."
So, what say on this Doc Dova ?

Dova ji,...I was speaking to a libertarian from Texas, and he did not provide a satisfactory response to the following premise:

The second amendment was established early in the country's history with the intent to place power in the hands of the people in case the government becomes tyrannical. However, both the people and the government had the same weapons back then.

Nowadays, the government has access to weaponry (and trained personnel to use them) that is much more powerful than anything civilians have. So the second amendment is now moot. What is you guys' view?

The five extra words that can fix the Second Amendment

Quote:
The first 10 amendments to the Constitution placed limits on the powers of the new federal government. Concern that a national standing army might pose a threat to the security of the separate states led to the adoption of the Second Amendment, which provides that “a well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.”

For more than 200 years following the adoption of that amendment, federal judges uniformly understood that the right protected by that text was limited in two ways: First, it applied only to keeping and bearing arms for military purposes, and second, while it limited the power of the federal government, it did not impose any limit whatsoever on the power of states or local governments to regulate the ownership or use of firearms. Thus, in United States v. Miller, decided in 1939, the court unanimously held that Congress could prohibit the possession of a sawed-off shotgun because that sort of weapon had no reasonable relation to the preservation or efficiency of a “well regulated Militia.”

When I joined the court in 1975, that holding was generally understood as limiting the scope of the Second Amendment to uses of arms that were related to military activities. During the years when Warren Burger was chief justice, from 1969 to 1986, no judge or justice expressed any doubt about the limited coverage of the amendment, and I cannot recall any judge suggesting that the amendment might place any limit on state authority to do anything.
What say sanelassi pai, agree with me, so far ?

Tell ya all folks and Echarchans / gaandmasti,. whatever,. of this forum,.. before you attempt to any New years day festival in NY, on new years' eve,.... just do not trust the security, no matter how tight is that, for bomb and gun checking on floor,.. but from any high-rises surrounding buildings any1 can do this and 30% crowd will die in stampede and rest at least 60 percent by the guy's auto rifles,... set in windows in series and think, if instead of one, what if there are 10-15 guys sitted(sic) in each window ?

What say, folks? US mass gathering is always risky, be it at party picnic, concerts, schools, or at any party,.. any1 can go mad for no reason and can pass your VIMA ! I totally agree with aashika ji, that
Gun control is a must must must screaming buy.
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