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  #1  
Old January 27th, 2017, 05:08 AM
Aashika Aashika is offline
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Do biological clocks slow down on other planets?

I was watching Interstellar and came up on the concept where time 1 hour on a different plant will equal 7 years on earth. Is that purely science fiction or is there any truth to it?
is time relative? So confused!
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Old January 27th, 2017, 09:25 AM
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Re: Do biological clocks slow down on other planets?

I found Interstellar very confusing too. My own personal theory is that there is no such thing as time... or in other words, it is just a man-made concept or creation or what have you. In actuality, everything is constant... bound in a single moment. It is because we need to figure out what is happening and to make some relative sense, we introduced time.
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Old January 27th, 2017, 09:39 AM
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Re: Do biological clocks slow down on other planets?

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Originally Posted by Sane Less View Post
I found Interstellar very confusing too. My own personal theory is that there is no such thing as time... or in other words, it is just a man-made concept or creation or what have you. In actuality, everything is constant... bound in a single moment. It is because we need to figure out what is happening and to make some relative sense, we introduced time.
I think we have time concept because of the day light and night time setting on earth? And course the time taken for a rotation and revolution of earth as well.

Correct me if I am on the right track, if we assume that time is constant (not relative).
So earth gets the gravity from a bigger mass (sun) and stays in its orbit (because of sun).
it takes 365 days to complete one revolution. You are at a certain distance from sun.

Now say you are near a black hole. very near. The mass of the black hole is higher than that of sun and you are way closer to it; so close that you run into the very real danger of being pulled into it. Then the time slows down (if you measure time in earth years).

So does it now mean gravity has a direct impact on time? If yes, would it not be relative?

Last edited by Aashika; January 27th, 2017 at 09:50 AM.
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Old January 27th, 2017, 11:01 AM
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Re: Do biological clocks slow down on other planets?

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Originally Posted by Aashika View Post
I think we have time concept because of the day light and night time setting on earth? And course the time taken for a rotation and revolution of earth as well.

Correct me if I am on the right track, if we assume that time is constant (not relative).
So earth gets the gravity from a bigger mass (sun) and stays in its orbit (because of sun).
it takes 365 days to complete one revolution. You are at a certain distance from sun.

Now say you are near a black hole. very near. The mass of the black hole is higher than that of sun and you are way closer to it; so close that you run into the very real danger of being pulled into it. Then the time slows down (if you measure time in earth years).

So does it now mean gravity has a direct impact on time? If yes, would it not be relative?
Correct if right ? How ? Move you to the wrong track ?
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Old January 27th, 2017, 11:22 AM
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Re: Do biological clocks slow down on other planets?

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Correct if right ? How ? Move you to the wrong track ?

sorry. the whole theory was so confusing
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Old January 27th, 2017, 12:39 PM
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Re: Do biological clocks slow down on other planets?

Some reading material to get you even more confused:

The Twin Paradox
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Old January 27th, 2017, 02:31 PM
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Re: Do biological clocks slow down on other planets?

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Originally Posted by Aashika View Post
I think we have time concept because of the day light and night time setting on earth? And course the time taken for a rotation and revolution of earth as well.

Correct me if I am on the right track, if we assume that time is constant (not relative).
So earth gets the gravity from a bigger mass (sun) and stays in its orbit (because of sun).
it takes 365 days to complete one revolution. You are at a certain distance from sun.

Now say you are near a black hole. very near. The mass of the black hole is higher than that of sun and you are way closer to it; so close that you run into the very real danger of being pulled into it. Then the time slows down (if you measure time in earth years).

So does it now mean gravity has a direct impact on time? If yes, would it not be relative?
gravity does have a direct impact on time. It is one of the conclusions of general theory of relativity.
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Old January 28th, 2017, 09:02 AM
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Re: Do biological clocks slow down on other planets?

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Originally Posted by Napolean View Post
gravity does have a direct impact on time. It is one of the conclusions of general theory of relativity.
The gravity would have to be really high for the time to slow down to this level.

BTW, hasnt anyone come up with the theory that all this was already known to our forefathers. 1 day in Brahmaloka is equal to 1 yuga on earth according to Shastras.
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Old January 30th, 2017, 05:53 AM
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Re: Do biological clocks slow down on other planets?

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Originally Posted by sgars View Post
The gravity would have to be really high for the time to slow down to this level.

BTW, hasnt anyone come up with the theory that all this was already known to our forefathers. 1 day in Brahmaloka is equal to 1 yuga on earth according to Shastras.
We are referring to something like a blackhole. So yes, we are talking high gravity.
I believe Einstein did
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Old January 30th, 2017, 10:41 AM
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Re: Do biological clocks slow down on other planets?

Before we can understand what is relativity, we must call in a few implications of the theory. I have simplified them here as much as possible for the layman to understand. Note I'm not an expert on it either, just one layman trying to help another here.

1. Time, space, mass, energy are not absolute because the only absolute in the theory of relativity is the speed of light C.

2. All the above four parameters, time, space, mass-energy synchronize themselves on the basis of the speed of light. So these objects change while only the speed of light remains constant in all frames of reference.

3. There are many relative frame of references and an absolute frame of reference does not exist. So here we have to abandon the conventional notions of space. time and mass-energy remaining constant.

4. Time in a simple sense relates to the rate of change in a system.

5. Faster the speed of an object, the higher is the mass of that object and this increased mass results in the slower rate of change (aka passage of time) to the observers inside the object aka a spaceship or some similar vehicle. This is their relative frame of reference and to an external observer on a slower inertial frame of reference, the time i.e. the rate of change will change faster. However the distance travelled by the ship will remain the same, its just that the astronauts inside will experience having reached the destination in a few hours will the external observer will note that the same ship took an year to reach the destination. Both are correct at the same time in their own frame of references.

6. This discrepancy is only noticeable at very high ratios of the speed of light and is almost negligible at slower speeds.

7. The dimensions of the ship too changes relatively to the speed of that ship , this effect is called space dilation.

8. The most braintwisting problem is the one when you try to measure the relative velocities of two photons crossing each other at opposite directions. In our classical Newtonian physics, if two cars pass each other by in opposite directions with each car going at 50 kmph speed, their relative velocity with respective to each other will add up to 100 kmph. But in Relativistic mechanics, when two photons with each travelling at the speed of light cross each other in opposite directions, THEIR RELATIVE VELOCITY IS STILL THE SPEED OF LIGHT AND NOT TWICE THE SPEED OF LIGHT.

9. Gravity too increases the masses of the objects and this increase in mass again leads to time dilation similar to those observers flying at relativistic speeds.

10. Gravity can too stretch and curve space since in relativity gravity is not a force, but instead a curvature in space and time. This effect is notably visible in high mass collision events like neutron star and black hole mergers as recently measured by the LIGO experiments which detected the distortion in spacetime by two blackholes far far away.


Coming to Interstellar.

1. The planet with the extreme time dilation effect was in the gravitational region of the blackhole where the gravity itself causes the time dilation. The plothole in Interstellar was how the spaceship managed to derive the energy to escape this region of space after leaving the planet. Usually once something enters such a region of space, it will take immense levels of energy to get out since you got to overcome the gravitational pull to break free from the region's chokehold. Its something like Hotel California, you can check in anytime, but never leave. HA HA HA!

2. Interstellar by itself is an overrated movie with plotholes as big as meteorite craters, but unfortunately overlooked due to hype.

Regarding the question whether your biological clock slow down on other planets, I have this to say.

Say if you land on a planet like Jupiter, the change in mass will not be all that much to slow down your biological clock before you expire because of other extreme conditions like heart failure because of the stress of pumping blood that weights seven time more than on Earth, your bones getting crushed because you weigh seven times more on Jupiter more than Earth.

Now if you plan a really long shot and try to land on a heavier object like a neutron star, then you better forget about the rate of your biological clock and worry more about getting squeezed by the neutron star's gravitational force in a ball of mass less than a few nanometers in size.

Fun fact: If a human with a mass of 50 kgs impacts on the surface of a neutron star at half the speed of light, the resulting explosion will release the energy equivalent to 200 megatons of TNT i.e. four times the power of the largest hydrogen bomb tested by the human race, the Tsara Bomba by Russia with a yield of 50 megatons.
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Old January 30th, 2017, 10:57 AM
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Re: Do biological clocks slow down on other planets?

Till date we are aware of light as the fastest,maybe there is something faster then light and if we find it the whole theory of relativity would change.
Again,the Theory of Relativity may work only in our galaxy other galaxies may or surely have a different set of physics where our physics may be too primitive for them or the laws wont work there at all.
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Old January 30th, 2017, 12:23 PM
Aashika Aashika is offline
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Re: Do biological clocks slow down on other planets?

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Originally Posted by Origmos View Post

5. Faster the speed of an object, the higher is the mass of that object and this increased mass results in the slower rate of change (aka passage of time) to the observers inside the object aka a spaceship or some similar vehicle. This is their relative frame of reference and to an external observer on a slower inertial frame of reference, the time i.e. the rate of change will change faster. However the distance travelled by the ship will remain the same, its just that the astronauts inside will experience having reached the destination in a few hours will the external observer will note that the same ship took an year to reach the destination. Both are correct at the same time in their own frame of references.
This.

so that planet Cooper was on (near the black-hole) was moving much much faster than earth. And the planet is also so close to a bigger higher gravitational body (black-hole) compared to earth (and its gravitational source, sun). Hence the time spent there on that planet is less to the person staying on that planet.

To the outside observer, time is going according to earth's pace.


am i on right track?
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Old January 30th, 2017, 07:19 PM
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Re: Do biological clocks slow down on other planets?

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Originally Posted by Aashika View Post
I believe Einstein did
I actually meant that interstellar copied from our Shastras- like Matrix did.
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Old January 30th, 2017, 08:46 PM
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Re: Do biological clocks slow down on other planets?

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Originally Posted by sgars View Post
BTW, hasnt anyone come up with the theory that all this was already known to our forefathers. 1 day in Brahmaloka is equal to 1 yuga on earth according to Shastras.
Here is the calculation according to vedas which may indirectly mean that biological clock differs in space.


Age of Universe according to Vedas


I wrote this article long back so putting it here without much modifications. It talks about the current age (and total age) of universe as described by Vedas (sacred books of Hinduism). According to modern science, there are two theories:
a. The Steady State theory, which says the universe is never born, never dies, and is always like what it is.
b. The Big bang theory, which says the universe began with a point of energy exploding in a "big-bang".

Since the universe is expanding and evolving, 1st theory is not 100% correct automatically. Big Bang theory says that the current age of universe is 11-20 billion years. But according to new observations, i.e. clusters of galaxies, super-clusters, Great Wall (Tully's complexes), it is quite evident that our universe is much much older than that. Lots of cosmologist believe that big-bang theory is not correct although it is most widely accepted. In short, modern man is not aware of forces and science which are needed to expain the creation of universe.
Lets look at vedic science and what it says. Right now I am quoting only what it says:
a. Total age of universe is 311.04 trillion years (human years).
b. Current age is around 155.521972944 trillion years.

How it is calculated:
-> There are 4 ages on earth which keeps circulating:
Satya Yuga - 1.728 million years
Treta Yuga - 1.296 million years
Dwapara Yuga - 0.864 million years
Kali Yuga - 0.432 million years

Total: 4.32 million human years.

-> This yuga cycle is called maha (in english, it means great/big) or divya (divine) yuga. One thousand such cycles forms one day of Brahma (a demigod in hindu religion which governs the universe). So one day of Brahma is 4.32 million * 1000 = 4.32 billion human years. Each such day of Brahma is called a "kalpa". His night also constitutes 4.32 billion human years. During his day, life exists in universe. In nighttime, no form of life exists. So one complete day and night has 8.64 billion human years.

-> Age of Brahma is 100 years. Each year of Brahma has 360 days and same number of nights. Thus, total age of Brahma is 360 * 100 * 8.64 billion = 311,040 billion human years. i.e. 311.04 trillion years. This period is called "maha kalpa".
-> The life span of the universe is one "maha kalpa". i.e. 311.04 trillion human years. This time span is also the duration of one breath of "Vishnu" (the ultimate god in hindu religion). When he exhales, thousands of universes emerges and one "Brahma" is born in each universe. When "Vishnu" inhales, all universes get sucked and Brahma dies.
-> This cycle is non-ending and eternal. Thats why "Vishnu" is considered eternal in Vedic Science (or religion).
How much old is our universe:
-> Note that the period of Satya Yuga is 0.4x, Treta Yuga is 0.3x, Dwapara Yuga is 0.2x and Kali Yuga is 0.1x where x is the time-span of one maha-yuga cycle. I will use 'x' as 1 maha-yuga cycle subsequently.
-> In 1 day of Brahma, there are 14 "manvantara". Each "manvantara" is divided into 71 "maha-yuga" cycles. So total make 14*71 = 994x (mahayuga cycles).
-> Remaining cycles (1 day of Brahma contains 1000 maha-yuga cycles) are used to fill gaps between manvantara. Before and after each manvantara (called as "sandhya" and "sandhyamsa" respectively), there is a junction of 1.728 million (age of Satya Yuga, or 0.4x) human years. Total number of junctions are 15 (since there are 14 manvantaras). So total gap period is = 0.4 * 15 = 6x. Hence total makes 1000 maha-yuga cycles or 1 brahma day.
-> According to the Vedic texts, current age of Brahma is 50 Brahma years and 1 brahma day (we are in the 1st day of 2nd half of brahma)and we are in the seventh "manvantara", in the 28th turnover of its 71 yuga cycles. In this cycle, we are in the start Kali Yuga. Age of kali yuga is not known perfectly but it is around 5000-10000 years. For calculation, lets assume 8000 human years.
-> So current age of our universe (in terms of maha-yuga cycles) =
(50 * 720 * 1000) -- 50 years * (360 days + 360 nights) * total no. of cycles in one day/night
+ (6 * 71) -- 6 manvantara each of 71 maha-yuga cycle
+ (7 * 0.4) -- 7 junctions or gaps for 6 manvantara
+ (27 * 1) -- we are in 28th cycle of 71
+ (0.4+0.3+0.2) -- In this cycle, we are in Kali Yuga. Satya Yuga, Treat Yuga and Dwapara yuga are 0.4x, 0.3x and 0.2x respectively.
+ around 8000 human years -- very small, so ignoring it.

Thus total age = (36,000,000 + 456.7)x = 36,000,456.7 * 4.32 million = 155,521,972.944 million years = 155.521972944 trillion human years. Now add the age of kaliyuga. i.e. around 8000 human years. One we calculate the exact age of kaliyuga, we can know the exact age of universe.
How ancient Indians (or Vedic people, more precisely) come up with these numbers, I dont have a clue.
http://www.cs.ubc.ca/~goyal/age_of_universe.php
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Old January 31st, 2017, 09:14 AM
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Re: Do biological clocks slow down on other planets?

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Originally Posted by Aashika View Post
This.

so that planet Cooper was on (near the black-hole) was moving much much faster than earth. And the planet is also so close to a bigger higher gravitational body (black-hole) compared to earth (and its gravitational source, sun). Hence the time spent there on that planet is less to the person staying on that planet.

To the outside observer, time is going according to earth's pace.


am i on right track?
Yes, you are on the right track. The gravitational force of the blackhole makes the mass of that particular planet extraordinarily heavy and the bodies of the astronauts too. This lead to the decreasing in the rate of change in their bodies in relation with bodies outside this region of intense gravitational effect.

So for the brief period of time spent by the astronauts on that planet, the equivalent time for the outside observer was in the region of almost two decades or so. Now while sounds cool and mindblowing, it is a blooming plothole in the movie's script as the planet need to be a zone of extreme gravity in order to experience such scales of time dilation. For instance even in the case if the gravity caused time dilation was equivalent to flying at almost 99.99% of the speed of light, the actual time dilation would only be around 9 minutes to the external observer for every second the astronauts spent on that planet.

Here is a link to an online calculator that will let you calculate the time dilation effects by yourself at speeds close to light.

http://keisan.casio.com/exec/system/1224059993
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