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  #1  
Old January 6th, 2003, 07:23 AM
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Why India is a 3rd world country while the rest of the world is zooming past us?

Lets look at some of the injustice done in history.

Holocaust. Jews were fried alive and that too not too distant in the past. They have moved forward and now do not see every german as a Nazi and have become one of the most influential, rich and powerful people in the world.

African Americans. They were enslaved, lynched, and literally dehumanized. Today, there are a few who cause trouble (basically reverse racism) but overall mindset of seeing every white man as a slave owner is gone.

Same case in most of europe.

Look at India. Dalits have this feeling deep rooted in them of having been dehumanized while in reality, I accept they got a real bad end of the deal but they were never enslaved, systematically lynched or for that matter marched into gas chambers. But after centuries of all that stopping (they themselves admit, brits changed their way of life to a great extent).. still want subsidies, preferential treatment from generation of uppercasts who had nothing to do with the original wrongdoers. They fail to realize that education is based on competetion and their betterment lies in studying well instead of harping why I did not get a college seat when I got 0 marks while a guy who got -1 got in.. They are like crabs who will not let india progress and will always be hiding inside their leaders skirts and claim as a genuine right all that reservation stuff.

I think they are just like the african american folks here who shun education (college dropouts) become bums and join the "hood" and then cry that they did not get a fair deal in achieving the so called "American dream". The ones who realized the importance of getting out of that mindset are pretty much in high positions.. Colin powel, condi rice too many to name.

Stupid will always remain so.. STUPID.


Nice thread to keep echarcha boiling for a while I guess

Ok adidravida and your ilks.. welcome for a new round of bashing.
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  #2  
Old January 6th, 2003, 07:41 AM
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Ravi, I think the problem lies not with Dalits but with the government policy. The Dalits have got so used to getting everything free that they don't want to work anymore. I don't think there is such thing as "reservations" in the US. If the GOI starts the same policy of no-reservations or reservation on a purely economic basis, I feel that we wouldn't have this problem. But then the govt is interested in votes, what do they care what happens to the country.

Sindhis came to India from Pakistan with nothing. But look how they have flourished. They took the efforts and got the fruits.
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Old January 6th, 2003, 07:42 AM
AdiDravida AdiDravida is offline
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Gpel, how can i disappoint you..

I tried a search in Google News for the word Dalit. The latest news had atleast half the news which are attrocities against Dalits. So i guess its not the past problems. Casteism is still a problem.



http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&q=Dalit+


PS: Even i have nothing to do. That is why i am replying to this deadbeat subject.
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  #4  
Old January 6th, 2003, 07:44 AM
desinetcharge desinetcharge is offline
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India has at it's core one problem that causes all the rest of it's problems OVERPOPULATION, I can't remeber going anywhere in India without seeing another person. Overpopulation creates a population so large that is too hard to educate all or even a decent majority which creates a pool of illiterate people who can exploited by a form of Indian parasite called the politican. This mentioned parasite feeds on the body of the country while waving the country's flag and robbing it's pockets.

The burgeoning IT sector will only help a handful few in Bangalore and Hyderabad while the masses in UP, Bihar, Bengal and other states will slide into even more backwardness. China which has a immense manufacturing capacity has made huge investments in infrastructure while India is stuck with roads comparable to the worst in Africa.

India is a talented nation simply burdened with too many people.
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  #5  
Old January 6th, 2003, 07:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Netra
Ravi, I think the problem lies not with Dalits but with the government policy. The Dalits have got so used to getting everything free that they don't want to work anymore. I don't think there is such thing as "reservations" in the US. If the GOI starts the same policy of no-reservations or reservation on a purely economic basis, I feel that we wouldn't have this problem. But then the govt is interested in votes, what do they care what happens to the country.

Sindhis came to India from Pakistan with nothing. But look how they have flourished. They took the efforts and got the fruits.

Absolutely.. thats the point. All that these folks need is a spank in their bare bottom and then they will automatically learn how to sit for a few hours and pour over educational materials and get educated. As it stands now they have no incentive to waste precious time on studies which can otherwise be used elsewhere like playing gulli danda or flying kites.


Adi.. I knew you would come.. was missing you so posted this dead beat subject.

By the way this post was inspired by that slavery/captivity post..
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  #6  
Old January 6th, 2003, 07:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by AdiDravida
Gpel, how can i disappoint you..

I tried a search in Google News for the word Dalit. The latest news had atleast half the news which are attrocities against Dalits. So i guess its not the past problems. Casteism is still a problem.



http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&q=Dalit+


PS: Even i have nothing to do. That is why i am replying to this deadbeat subject.
By the way adi, you go on any search engine and type a particular key word and you will find gazillion news items. Thats how it works.. from neutral ones to the ones with obvious agendas.

Also if A kills B what is the caste of B got to do with it.. it was a crime by one human on another.. yes if it so happens that there exists a caste differential between A and B it will be flagged as a dalit biased crime.. irrespective of the motive behind the crime so stuff that link and give some intelligent rejoinder.

Todays so called "dalit" crimes are, most of the times, a direct result of the reservation system.
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Old January 6th, 2003, 07:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by GpeL
Absolutely.. thats the point. All that these folks need is a spank in their bare bottom and then they will automatically learn how to sit for a few hours and pour over educational materials and get educated. As it stands now they have no incentive to waste precious time on studies which can otherwise be used elsewhere like playing gulli danda or flying kites.


Adi.. I knew you would come.. was missing you so posted this dead beat subject.

By the way this post was inspired by that slavery/captivity post..
Ravi, i have a few dalit friends. and all dalits in my class are doing real well. I am sure they would not be were they are if it were not for reservation. I dont think we can blame dalits for our country being 3rd world country.

The country was never ruled by dalits since our freedom...nor have they held high position.. the money spent on them cannot be more 1/10th what is spent on our defense..

Every country has its social responsibilites towards its downtrodend.. in india its in form of reservation, in US its affirmative action.. in US it succeded because the majority of society participated in it and judicial system played a fair role. But in India its not case. I have read here somewhere.. maybe Adi would have posted..that reservation was there for 10years.. and its because govt could not implement it properly, it still continues. Its not vote bank politics.. i think its caste based politics.. they simply dont want to implement reservation...
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Old January 6th, 2003, 08:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by GpeL
Todays so called "dalit" crimes are, most of the times, a direct result of the reservation system.
Can u prove this statement from any of the news that u have read. Has any news report or govt or NGO report stated that crimes committed on Dalits are due to reservation. Show me one report.

Dont make blind statements.

Note:
News.google.com searches only News websites, this search does not include website like ambedkar.org
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  #9  
Old January 6th, 2003, 08:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by BlrBoy
Ravi, i have a few dalit friends. and all dalits in my class are doing real well. I am sure they would not be were they are if it were not for reservation. I dont think we can blame dalits for our country being 3rd world country.
That is exactly the point.. if they are doing real well, that means they have the capacity to achieve. Such folks should not be required to use reservation as their stepping stone. Multiple generations of some of my SC/ST friends have used the system. I would not be too concerened if only one generation gets to use it but once that guy has achived he should be in a position to tell his children to study well and should not be eligible for reservation anymore. That is the extreme I can digest.. I say no reservations finished.. time up.. realize you got to put in effort and get ahead with others. A country cannot progress by leaving behind a segment of our population at the same time it cannot keep pace with the developed world by "tagging" along folks who won't otherwise progress.. its what makes our country third world. Dalit politics, Dalit vote bank and those agendas split the electorate and eventually you get a three legged horse running the country.
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Old January 6th, 2003, 08:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by AdiDravida
Can u prove this statement from any of the news that u have read. Has any news report or govt or NGO report stated that crimes committed on Dalits are due to reservation. Show me one report.

Dont make blind statements.

Note:
News.google.com searches only News websites, this search does not include website like ambedkar.org
Go and read your link yourself..

Dalit student beaten up where 2 news along with a dalit rape (which could have been anyone for that matter and the woman turns out to be a dalit and for all you know a dalit could have been the rapist too). Agreed some crimes are still there but they do get prosecuted so arguing that castism is still an issue and it somehow justifies reservation is really LAME..
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Old January 6th, 2003, 08:12 AM
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Adi, FYI,

of the 2 pages of links you gave (google search results) most of them do not work so the facts of the case are just hidden.
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Old January 6th, 2003, 11:30 PM
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What's most infuriating about the reservation system is that the people who badly need it i.e the people living in remote villages have no inkling that such a system exists. Its the well-off dalits in urban areas who are making the most of it when they can very well go ahead in life on their own.
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Old January 7th, 2003, 12:25 AM
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gpelu

pelu,

u never fail to disappoint me.

u seem to have a preoccupation with dalits.

even if u say that dalits are getting 50% of government seats and jobs, r they bringing DOWN the standard of the other 50%?
It does not sound possible. On the other hand i wud say they r increasing the standard of the other 50% because one really needs to be talented to get in in the unreserved quota!
and this 50% with India's population is a big number compared to any country.

I sincerely hope that educated capable people like u seriously think and introspect on why Indians in the US are not doing as well as Jews in the US. that will be good for u as well for India.

did u have a dalit room mate or did u study under dalit teachers for long? ur iq seems to have slid to dalit standards.

u r fighting for BONES with dalits, meat is elsewhere!

with regards.

Last edited by CYBERIAN; January 7th, 2003 at 12:40 AM.
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Old January 7th, 2003, 12:37 AM
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cyberian, i disagree. the reserved quotas are bringing standards down across the board. how can you put someone in, say, a medical school when he has passed with 30% simply because he comes from a backward caste?
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Old January 7th, 2003, 02:38 AM
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I have very good example. One of my class mate got exact 42% at graduation but he got admission to PG in our college (which is the best in pune). This is because there were only 2 students in that category (dont know which) in whole Univ.

On the other hand one of my friend who really tried hard(he got 74%) didnt get admission to college.

One more observation made in last 3-4 yrs is that only 10-20% of students which are in from reserved quota get jobs through campus ints. And around 95% of open cat students them get them. [ Recruiters deosnt know who all are from reserved category ]

The point is, these 50% really bring down quality except few ones. This is just small example of what Gpel is saying.
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Last edited by ShivSainik; January 7th, 2003 at 02:41 AM.
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